Thanks tortron, you made me feel like a :burgerking:
Printable View
MAJOR DISCOVERY ~ PROGRESS ~ :thumbup:
?? DISCOVERED ?? WHY OUR TRUCK WON'T START & DIED A SLOW DEATH TO THAT POINT ~ THE CARBURETOR FLOAT IS ABOUT 1/5 to 1/4 FULL OF FLUID, I JUST NOW GAVE IT A SHAKE... I LOOKED AT THE NEEDLE & SEAT, THEY BOTH LOOKED PERFECT... FUEL BOWL WAS DRY WHEN WE PULLED THE CARB TWO DAYS AGO; SO I BET THAT FLOAT COULD HAVE HAD EVEN MORE FUEL INSIDE AS IT WAS RIDING SLOSHING WAVES OF GAS..? JUST VACUUM TESTED THE NEW NEEDLE & SEAT 'n FLOAT ASSEMBLY ON MY REBUILD FRANKENSTEIN; PASSES EVERY TIME :^) ALSO APPLIED 12 VOLTS TO BOTH THE J/Y BVV ELECTROMAGNET & MY ORIGINAL; THE ORIGINAL HAS A LITTLE STRONGER PULL & IT WILL GET USED IN THE MONSTER... PLAYED PUZZLE WITH TOP & BOTTOM THROTTLE BODY GASKETS; ALMOST GOT TRICKED BY MINOR THROTTLE BORE SIZE DIFFERENCES... MIKES'S CARBURETORS SUPPLIED FILTER https://www.carburetor-parts.com/Mikuni-Solex_c_28.html
http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin...id=25754&stc=1http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin...id=25755&stc=1
Nice sleuth work xbox :thumbup: The fuel float full of crusty fuel - not so good...
Bummer they don't include a new float in the rebuild kit. They do with Weber and the one I got for my motorcycle. I thought they did with all kits.
I bought a replacement float from RA 'n it would probably work but it's a rather different configuration & as such, the float level measurement is taken a completely different way than the factory method (strange...) but I'm using my original float... It's a darn good thing member yamahauler sent me an FSM & member 4cylinders sent me a Mikuni carburetor in parts and a darn good thing parts puller Allen in Roseville, CA sent me the PicknPull 1985 California emissions Mikuni ~ without all these spare parts and a 2nd Mikuni carburetor; I do believe it would have been somewhere between tremendously difficult & darn near impossible for me to rebuild the Mikuni carburetor... With little to no practice and having to wait several months for parts, the memory fades with the large amount of time between disassembly & reassembly... There are four letter words that describe the situation better than my story above..!
BACKGROUND NOTES:
1) Leaking float & improper float adjustment caused flooding of an otherwise nicely rebuilt Mikuni (PicknPull carb)
2) My original Mikuni was a one barrel carb, not anymore, if it runs, it should work as a 2 barrel carby
3) My advice about carburetors, buy a rebuilt Mikuni 'n bolt it on OR modify with a new Weber (in that order..!)
4) Unless you have parts, tools, patience & experience, rebuilding the Mikuni is not my recommendation...
5) Is it just me..? Or, will the ball bearing in the fuel bowl drop out of place if the carb is turned upsidedown..?
6) In regards to #5 above (if yes) then the carburetor top needs removal again..! Yikes..!
7) In regards to #5 & #6 above; does the float prevent the large ball bearing from falling out of place..?
8) How would a person (perform a test) to get the answer in regard to #5, #6 and #7 above..?
Get the Wife to do the Work..? :grin:
You don't get a choke release assist diaphragm (there are a few different types which is helpful too...) and some kits don't even have the accelerator pump diaphragm and gaskets in them (straight up useless as they are prone to failing). A 100% overhaul kit would have a new secondary actuator servo, a wax pellet for the choke, the choke assist and gaskets for 3 different 32-35DIDTA carb variants and the replacement fuel bowl float (say hi to a $500 rebuild kit) but they don't make them as nobody would buy them :)
I have a Hygrade FL87 float that's of no use to me. It's yours if you want it.
Regarding the ball in the float chamber, it sits in the channel in the bottom of the chamber shown in the first picture of your first post on 9/11/20. The ball is kept in the channel by two stamped strips of metal held in place by the two pins and screw/washer at mid-bottom of the chamber. In the event your grocery run takes a disastrous and unexpected turn, the ball pushes on either of the metal strips which in turn contacts the float stopping the fuel flow. I wouldn't worry about omitting the ball and definitely delete it if you don't have the metal strips. I've disassembled several remanufactured carbs and none of them had the ball and metal strips. Unless you do some serious 4-wheeling, omit it. Probability is in your favor.
Thanks fellahs for all this seriously helpful information... :thumbup:
We almost got to the point of connecting the battery for a try at starting the truck last night... :thumbup:
UNTIL I tried placing the air cleaner rubber gasket on the carb; it was missing the ring 'n 2 screws... :thumbdown:
Hiked back to the room to get the ring and Oh Boy, it felt like I just received some really bad news... :thumbdown:
There in my parts basket were parts #68, #69 and #70 for both primary & secondary throttles..! :yellow1:
At least we did not contaminate things with gasoline or coolant... :thumbup:
It won't require a complete teardown but the carb top piece needs to come off again; I made a note of 5 other things to do as well... :thumbup:
See, Stop is Good Progress..! :rolleyes:
Of special interest to me was finding a bunch of gooey electrical silicone inside the female half of the TPS connector... THIS might be the cause of weird engine running, hope so... Will clean it out even more on our 2nd carb install try...
Best part of last night was neither me nor wife got upset about the forgotten parts discovery ~ she complimented me for not getting angry & said it's your 1st try @ fixing this Mikuni thing, no surprise you made a mistake... Just don't drink too much beer when working on it, OK..?
Confession Complete & Staying Safe 'n Smoke Free in Hawaii --
Aloha George
That is probably Di-electric grease which is meant to prevent oxidation and connectivity breakdown that comes with as you probably know :)
You are doing better than I would.
Nah no better, I seen your work methods 85RAM :thumbup:
That dialectric grease is weird, the label says it conducts electricity... A good thing for turn signal & stop light bulbs BUT no so good on spark plug wires or computer control sensors... It can foul up the TPS signals to the computer...
LIVE & LEARNING ME
Yeah you need the opposite like lanolin grease. I created an ignition problem by using a conductive grease on my spark plug boots - it misfired like it was possessed :doh:
xbox,
With respects I need to correct some of Your info.
Dielectric grease is not conductive, as such if a sensor connector is filled with same there is a good chance
sensor input, ground, or v/ref could be skewed. ( sensor circuits are 5v & usually <.005 ampere ).
As far as plug boot usage , all I ever used was dielectric , 20 plus years as dealership driveability tech
literally hundreds of plug and wire changes.
Perhaps the tube label your looking at is 'thermal grease' ?
Thx.
Yes I better read that label again -- I bought the large dispening tube and used a big glob of it in the spark plug boots 2 years ago when installing new wires & plugs -- the engine ran like crap after that -- ?? So after I cleaned off the dielectric grease it ran good like it had new plugs & wires... On the carb TPS (throttle position sensor) I remember injecting a big glob of it into the TPS connector after Vernon had super glued my original carb's cracked phenolic body... On startup the truck ran crappy not smooth like before -- next was gas still leaking bad glue for gas -- rcvd J/Y carb & installed the truck ran weird crappy still BUT NO gas leaks -- so, I'm gonna try paint thinner to clean out that goop as electrical contact cleaner spray & wiping does not get it out -- I want it clean NO GOOP when we try starting it with this rebuilt carb --
My Lenovo T61 laptop has FAN ERROR -- so soon I will try my hand at electronics rebuilding
:lmao:
REBUILT MIKUNI INSTALLED :thumbup:
Engine cranked but no pop sputter or trying to start -- I hope the battery will have enuff omph left to try with starting fluid... I remember mechanics getting this truck running when we 1st bought it -- sprayed starter fluid & cranked a bunch of times before it finally began to fire... I think they even dumped some gas in the carb...
You're right on both counts -- it is non conductive & directions say use sparingly -- I thought dielectric grease would improve a connection but it does just the opposite... I injected a pea size amount of it into the spark plug boot BUT I'm going back in to remove it to achieve a better electrical connection to the spark plugs...
Rebuilt Mikuni installed but truck won't start or act like it wants to start... Used tablespoon of gas or 3 seconds spray of starter fluid one or the other 8 good tries..! Battery cranking good & good spark at the plugs... Eng front cover has marks 10BTDC 0 10ATDC -- no mark or notch on crankshaft pullys... Will have to remove # 1 spark plug & find TDC on compression stroke... <--- how is that done without removing rocker arm cover..? Thumb on sparkplug hole or buy a compression gauge..? Truck not running or started for 3 months, maybe it needs oil fog sprayed into the cylinders not just for lube but to ensure having compression..?
We will be very sad to let this truck go... But we need transportation not a never ending class in auto mechanics with us supplying the school with tools...
:thumbdown:
The mark on the balancer is one line full width, indented. You might be able to feel it if you cannot see it. I mark mine with a silver sharpie when I need to see it. Is gas pumping through the carb?
To find TDC I use a tissue to watch as I turn for the compression stroke. It will blow the tissue, then I put a screwdriver in the plug hole and hold it loosely. When the piston gets to the top it will start to go down and you will feel it. There ya go.
Thank you 85Ram50 the tissue idea is trick, I don't think my 3/8 socket set will fit the crank bolt, so I either learn how to use a screwdriver to short the starter selenoid wires or use the ignition key -- I don't plan on spending $25.00 for O'Reilly to sell me a remote starter switch... OReillys is charging my battery now, the battery has plenty power this is just extra step -- I don't know if the fuel pump has gotten fuel to the carb -- I thought after checking ign timing that I would remove the carb fuel supply hose from the fuel pump barb -- I rented a compression tester from O'Reillys and bought a spray can of fogger fogging oil -- the cylinders could use some lube I bet & as well as checking ign timing might as well do a compression test -- there might be more to this than a previously flooding carb -- ? -- if the balancer has a line to mark TDC I will be super suprised nothing there
I think the crank is a 17mm. If you are removing the plugs any wrench that opens big enough will work, it turns pretty easily with the plugs out. My 3/8 drive turns it easily. A remote starter or bumping the starter will move it to far too fast. I should have stated TDC Compression stroke, as there is the exhaust stroke 180 out that will feel the same so making sure the rotor is pointing at #1 helps. It ran so you could not have been too far out when you parked it. I thought you just wanted to improve annoying things it did because of the carb being old. You need more then a few teaspoons of gas. At least use tablespoons. :)
I always just put the truck in reverse gear and released the parking brake. Then pushed on the bumper with my knee to rotate the engine over.
if the truck has a belt. The timing mark is below the flat of the head. Many people get it off 1 tooth because they go off the flat of the head.
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I need these details, thanks guys... The timing mark I'm searching for is on the fan belt pulley somwhere, this truck has two V belts alt & pwr steering -- I'm gonna look at the pulley lip closest to the engine (Dr. geezer's advice)
Darn, my resident apt mgr just texted me if I got the truck running yet or if I wanted to sell it..? Howz that for moral support..?
Going now to get my fully charged Interstate battery -- O'Reillys charged it for free... They have a $26.00 + tax remote start switch -- now I'm confused if it will help me spin the engine with spark plugs removed to inject the fogging oil I bought yesterday -- all this extra stuff is beyond just starting the engine after a carb rebuild BECAUSE before we got it parked back at the apt Vernon could not get it to start & neither could Sam @ his Windward Muffler repair shop -- not any responce even with good spark starter fluid & gas stopped on carb -- something is amiss -- Dr. geezer has a few more things for me to check as well
ALOHA George :shrug:
Ign timing check
Spark plug wire routing check
Compression test
Test each spark plug separately for firing
Check proper fuel line connect to carb
Check gas tank level -- dash gauge reads 3/8
Remove fuel pump to carb inlet hose to check if fuel pump is pumping gas
Yada Yada Yada
What then if still NO RESPONCE when trying to start..? Just fishing for more ideas that hopefully won' t be needed in the near future...
xboxrox,
Remove the fuel inlet line to the carburetor, fab up a remote reservoir & hose, attach to inlet--- fill the float bowl ---
Pump pedal thrice ,start & report back.
Thx
I misled you Xbox. I was picturing my Dakota when I told you about the mark. Here is a picture of mine. The white spot is the notch on the inner pulley closest to the timing belt cover. It is a notch so you should be able to feel it.
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Not mislead 85RamGuy ~ "perfect timing" (pun intended) as I should get to the point of finding it today -- I got my battery back from OReillys, they charged it but said: "it FAILED the load test, might have a bad cell..." My computer died the FAN ERROR fatal startup failure & can't upload photo from my phone SO THANKS A BUNCH for this photo you sent... I broke down 'n bought the remote start switch a dang cheapo innova Made - in - :count:
Yeah, setting the timing on a G63B/4G64 is a little easier than the 4G52/4G54 as you can see everything. You have spark - this is the hardest hurdle to overcome on a no start engine. Checking the timing is a PITA if you can't see marks but seeming you haven't pulled the head off or replaced the chain, you at least know nothing has changed there.
THX geezer man -- got the battery installed & connected the innova remote start switch to the starter seleniod terminals S small terminal & B large terminal lead to battery and the starter motor would spin but did not engage the flywheel -- taking a break now -- going down to work on the truck in a few minutes -- 1st thing I wanna try is cranking the engine using the ignition key -- if the engine don't crank I will be very disappointed -- my battery cranked the engine strongly before getting it charged -- I just wanted to make sure it was fully charged after sitting 3 months -- it cranked the engine very well yesterday
End Rant
EDIT: The remote starter switch is cranking the engine ok now ~ with key in OFF position engine only cranks ~ with key in ON position spark goes to the spark plugs ~ tested all plugs, they are getting orange colored spark
Found the pulley timing mark & found a major problem -- can you guess. ?
All four spark plug wires were in the wrong spot on the dist cap ~ all off by 90 degrees..! :rolleyes:
IT STARTED & IT RUNS :cheers:
VIDEO of the startup: https://youtu.be/zzV380LVKFM
Fuel hose orientation? Fuel cut solenoid on the carb not connected? No fuel - at all? Distributor 174 and 3/4 degrees out? :shrug:
geezer ~ once I get my laptop computer fixed I can post a photo story ~ photos from my phone are not accepted for posting here... The wife happened to get a not too great short video of the sucessful startup ~ phone can't upload it either ~ all the more reason to try fixing my old puter...
Finding that pulley timing mark was the key to unlocking the mystery ~ it was strange because original problem was flooding then turned into an ignition timing problem ~ kinda like trying to discover a flu or covid vaccine but the darn virus keeps mutating ~ the truck was having mutating problems (too many hands touching stuff over 'n over )
More later & Mucho Gracias to all you MR50 Whizards :thumbup:
can you edit photos on your phone? If so reduce them to 800x600.
Dead truck towed home for a 3 month bed rest before a Mikuni heart transplant ~ https://youtu.be/Z4d6O2W-dsY
1st starup & running, too much fogging oil, sounds like WWII fighter plane startup ~
https://youtu.be/zzV380LVKFM
2nd startup it's still fighting fogging oil ~
https://youtu.be/oOPcH3FYD54
3rd startup WWII Merlin engine sound ~ https://youtu.be/GYcKdK7hmEo
Notice the oil stain under the steering gear area in the 2nd startup vid
:)) :thumbup:
:)):thumbup:
Before I started "fixing" on my truck it started first time by just pressing the gas pedal once then cranking it. 2 seconds of cranking and it was running.
Your second vid is unavailable.
8 days later how is it doing Xboxrox?
Sitting parked & waiting for timing light, laser tach and vacuum/pressure gauge test kit to arrive from Summit Racing -- ordered @ eBay a new throttle cable from seller in Greece -- have appointment for the annual State Safety Inspection tomorrow (no smog checks in Hawaii) received the hose pinch clamp set from Harbor Freight -- have thought about reassembling the J/Y Mikuni carb to visually inspect it's adjustment screw settings because other than leaking float that caused the no start, it ran well and had good slow idle -- should also inspect & measure it's idle mixture screw hole since the tamper plug is gone (might drill out the plug in the 86 carb to chase the high idle speed problem) Also gotta rechech TPS readings at idle & WOT and adjust if needed...
Hurry up and wait for now (one SR box arrived just now, vacuum gauge ?) -- maybe get motivated to epoxy my busted throttle cable -- working on the truck is like being a prisoner at night trying to dig an escape hole -- no vehicle work allowed in the buildings garage -- resident mgr & a few cranky security guards limit what can be done during the night
ALOHA & THANKS FOR ASKING
:thumbup:
Once it gets a leg over the fence it runs like a top ;) The broken throttle cable is annoying. It would be at this point I'd either substitute a cable or grind the shoulder off the broken cable and squeeze clamp a tube/pipe collar over it to hold it together and use the existing bracket on the carb to hold it down. Tip - HD mountain bike brake cables make great throttle cable replacements - just add a brass locking barrel on the pedal end once you have everything cut and routed.
Seems bicycle parts work pretty good on these Mitsubishi overgrown lawn mower engines :grin: my carb has a bike shop provided ball bearing in the sub egr he he... geezer your Macgyver skills are top notch & often become my Plan B :thumbup:
Tried to Safety Check the truck today but failed at that too :thumbdown: seems I tossed my old USAA Proof of Insurance too soon when I got the new one as it won't apply until Oct 7th which means I can't legally drive right now hmmm... On a positive note, tach & vacuum gauge arrived yesterday & timing light should arrive tomorrow... Although, I'm rather NOT motivated to tinker with our toy truck... Must be a sign of old age... Soon as we fix a computer I can post some pretty photos again, looking forward to that...
Staying Safe
MASKED MECHANIC IN TRAINING :wavegreen:
Don't they have a computerized system in Hawaii? Cops used to give people tickets in CA and I expect other states when they did not have a physical copy of their insurance card on them. Turns out they knew the truth one way or the other as the state Licensing system gets an automatic notice from your insurer before you even get the card in the mail they already know you are paid up. Anyway someone caught one and it they put a stop to writing tickets for no card if the computer records indicated you were paid up. You are still supposed to have one on you. Seems like that should also be true over there.
We have a similar issue here in Oz. South Australia did away with registration labels which allegedly saved owners money on their registration but the cops from the former democratic state of Viktorya ambushed anyone crossing the border with SA plates for failing to have valid registration details on them and fining them for having 'unregistered vehicles' (yes, they have access to the database but that takes time and effort blah blah...) The added bonus is they chose to launch their sting on a long weekend when there was an AFL grand final being held in the body cavity known as Melbourne. Cops were racking up revenue like they were printing money. Now everyone has wizened up and has DMV printed receipts on them.
Fun tip - I have been told that if you receive a fine interstate, pay an extra dollar. Apparently it screws up their system and they are unable finalise the infringement records (heard it drives the cops nuts lol)
Hawaii is the (only) or one of the only (USAA phone rep said: "ONLY") state that requires the Driver's Proof of Insurance I.D. card to be printed on the USAA Companies special paper with company golden watermark logos... A copy is not a valid I.D. Card and all copies sent via email & other ways are PDF saying in bold letters: "NOT A VALID PROOF OF INSURANCE" the only way to get a replacement card with golden logo paper is via SNAIL MAIL... So might as well just wait; have driven less than 20 miles total since June anyway :wtf:
Watching our Presidential Debate took away all desire to fix anything -- so me and wifey had a nice walk outside this evening :thumbup:
My point was that the state has a record making the enforcement of the requirement to have a card on you a bit dishonest.
Agreed ~ for the lawmakers they have a lot a B.S. ways to get more revenue ~ I'm pretty sure the min fine for not having the ins I.D. card is $500.00 even tho the police officer can see on his computer everything there is to know about your insurance coverage... I got ticketed once in Seattle for improper display of registration once ($75.00 ish?) even tho the policeman said I can tell your registration is current and paid... I had forgotten to put the little year sticker on the car's rear license plate...
:))
Truck sits unused while waiting for drivers insurance I.D. card effective date to begin Oct 7th -- recvd timing light vacuum gauge laser tach to help tune the engine and lower idle speed -- no working on vehicles parked here at the apartment garage
:))
Hey everyone -- truck passed safety inspection & runs but uses A LOT OF FUEL; it idles about 900 RPM -- the distributor vacuum advance not working the actuator diaphragm gave up the ghost -- plugging the vacuum hose did not lower the idle speed -- O'Reilly's has a Acardone rebuilt dist on island $154.00 -- Anyone know if these distributors have mechanical advance in addition to vacuum advance? Time to as Scotty Kilmer would say get your timing light & REV UP YOUR ENGINES -- except it too might be broke ($÷<^%:35/)
eBay has a 1984 D50 W engine dist vacuum actuator that looks similar dunno if it might work on my 1986 truck?
I rebuilt my Mikuni carb and am thinking to just stop trying to become a mechanic -- initial ignition timing now set @ 8° BTDC -- fiddling with carb adjustment screws no help so far --
Day 2 of opening tourism and Kailua beach is busy again, I wonder about Waikiki ? Last night saw two couples get cited on the beach by police on ATVs <--- ? Why I DUNNO ??
:grinno:
UPDATE: The truck currently starts & runs good, idle speed a little high by 100 RPM or so (but not always?) ~ got my laptop fixed & can upload photos now ~ used laser tach, timing light & hand vacuum pump to discover a new problem, the distributor vacuum advance diaphragm began leaking, did not advance the ignition timing ~ tested the mechanical advance, it works ok...
1) Replaced the dist vacuum advance actuator & tested vacuum advance, works good...
2) Changed engine oil twice & added polymer-ester additive to prolong life of flat tappets ~ no more noisy tappets
NOTE: Telltale sign of a vacuum leak on my truck is the brake pedal ~ the power feel of power brakes is deminished enuff to feel in the foot...
REBUILT MIKUNI PHOTOS
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NOTICE ANYTHING MISSING ON THIS CARBURETOR PHOTO (?) LUCKILY FIXED IT BEFORE CONNECTING FUEL & COOLANT :^) COULD NOT GET THE AIR CLEANER TO FIT ON THE CARB & WHEN I WENT TO GET THE MISSING PLATE & GASKET, NOTICED I ALSO FORGOT TO INSTALL BOTH THROTTLE VENTURIES OMG..!
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NEW VACUUM ADVANCE PHOTOS
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GETTING GROCERIES PHOTO
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Thank you all @ MightyRam50 ~ could not have done this without a whole lotta help from a lotta you members..!
:layrubber:
^
Me too, a reference was made to 'ALL' carburators using brass plugs for the 'rifle drilled' passages.
The statement is in error!!!
Oh, xbox,
My '88 with the P.O.S. Jap/French bastardized compromise engine control system ---
1) was supposed to be 'lean burn' (jet valve)
2) was supposed to be 'altitude compensating' -brain dead T/P & O/2 interpolation maps
3)was supposed to provide > 29 MPG , < 2.9K RPM
claych ~ yeah, I know what you mean..! I thought the 1986 carb'd trucks were the ultimate pain until I saw diagrams of the 87 'n later Gen2 carbs & engine bay of vacuum hoses -- I bet assembly line workers enjoyed slapping all that stuff together..! LOL 29MPG hmmm..?
Glad you didn't catch covid