Conclusive info on 4D56 head onto 4D55 block info?

[gard]

Alright. So I have read all of the threads and there is good speculation and information but nothing confirming anyone had solved their problem and are running and kicking ass. Here is a run down of my last 4-6 months dealing with this thing.

1. Truck ran and started awesome for me besides some minor tweaks here and there for the first six months but had an intermittent heat issue particularly when it was under a load. The gauge needle would reach an eighth of an inch below the top warning line.(white line not the red). I replaced these things.
A. Water pump.
B. Radiator hoses
C. Thermostat (went from 195 degrees to a 170 degrees)
D. Radiator cap (twice)
E. Reservoir hose and cap
F. Flushed the bejeesus out of the radiator every time I emptied it to replace something and a few times just for that.

2. After these measures the issue finally presented itself in full going up a hill after driving it for about an hour. While going up the hill the needle reached the top white warning line and I had to pull over after coasting the hill. The reservoir was spewing out air and coolant. Head breach. After reading the forum and from what I had seen on the one in the salvage, the head cracking isn’t uncommon, so I began my plans to replace the head.

3. In the process of preparing for the head swap I decided to have the radiator serviced and rodded, and had the turbo, injectors, and injection pump rebuilt.

4. I had a hard time finding a protruding valve head and the one I did find was sent to me with a stuck camshaft, so I decided to try the 4d56 head swap to flush valve. From reading on the forum it appeared others had done this and it had worked fine. The problem is that the threads usually end in advice given and the user with the error never gives conclusive evidence of the project turning out great for them. My assumption was that this meant they were rolling down the road, if they weren’t they would have been back for more advice. So I went for it.

5. I found out during the head swap my head seemed to be fine, but my issue was a misprinted gasket. The metal between pistons to seal the water channel was on the wrong side of the gasket, and it only goes on one way. That being said, my camshaft was junk, and I had mix matched caps from two engines. I still wanted to go with new stuff.

6. These are all the things that have changed or been replaced during this process.
A. Rebuilt Turbo. They used a TD-05 cartridge in place of the TC-05 cartridge because of part availability and to be easier to repair in the future.
B. Had radiator serviced and rodded.
C. Injectors rebuilt.
D. Injection pump rebuilt. (They replaced what needed it, really only the lift side appeared damage during operation, it was assisted by a 5-6psi 30gph electric inline pump)
E. MLS head gasket.
F. 4D56 flush valve head.
G. New oil and fuel filters (the water separator under the hood, and one I had before the electric pump, at this point with no electric pump and just the filter.
H. Flex a lite engine driven fan.

7. I had some issues getting it bled and started the first time, my primer handle doesn’t function, so I put the electric pump in the chain and bled it through the screw on top of the water separator and then to the timing plug on the injection pump. I had left injection lines cracked and spun the key a few minutes until diesel was spitting out of them, tightened them down, spinning the key between. Still not wanting to give it to me, so I used a squirt or two of ether. Started up rough, lots of white smoke, but eventually calmed down and sounded great. From then on it would start, albeit it rough, lots white smoke out of the exhaust, and lots of working the accelerator, then calm down.

8. During this I bullseyed an ear plug down an oil drain tube. Had to remove the pan and retrieve it. Wasn’t going to let that destroy my engine, and wasn’t going to be able to sleep knowing it was in there. Found it. Got the pan back on and took the opportunity to replace the steering components and the rubber on the stabilizer bar. Aggravating, but got something I needed to do done in the process.

9. Drove it the first time around the block and to the alignment shop. Cold start always sucks, lots of accelerator pedal to keep it going at first and high volumes of white remained. When warm, would start repeatedly on half key turn, right to 750 rpms idle and sounding great. In between warm and cold, the truck refuses to start. Glow plugs decide it is too warm to need their help, yet not warm enough to give me the half key turn start. If you unplug the temp sensor, glow plugs initiate and it fires right up, but rough and shitty as usual.

10. With the truck aligned, test driving truly began. Sometimes the thing would take off awesomely, and drive that way for 10-30 miles, then get incredibly bogged down and put out a lot of black smoke. More than I remembered it doing before, or what seems normal for it.

11. I found some leaking diesel around injector 1 at the return rail. Considering this and my compounded issues, I took these steps.
A. New return leaf washers.
B. Extra couple foot lbs torque on the injectors.
C. Replaced all fuel lines under the hood.
D. Put Teflon on the threads of the primer handle.
E. Adjusted down the throttle screw and the total fuel screw up until I was back at the idle I wanted. This time closer to 900 than 750 rpms.
12. I bleed the system of air again, and this time I leave the electric pump in line. Starts like crap, but smooths out. I drive it. Intermittent power loss. Will drive like a dream with more power than it has ever had, and then go limp and act completely starved.
A. Replace the fuel tank.
B. Warranty out the electric pump for one with 7-14psi 35.5 gph.
C. Another new filter before the electric pump.
13. Found out the tank had been coated with something on the bottom that looked like white paint. I assume some sort of rust treatment. Flakes a big as dimes of it floating around. Worth mentioning now, I had seen these flakes in the back filter (it’s clear) and in the plug for the water separator filter. Thinking I had my smoking gun, I start it, I drive it, same results. Lost at this point, I call in help from my mentor and diesel guru to come in person.

14. We check over some things, make sure the system is bled. We try some things.
A. Swapped the fuel cutoff solenoid with the one on the other pump. It is activating better.
B. Remove part of the exhaust and the muffler, inspect with flashlight, and test drive.
15. With the muffler off, there is an obvious noise when the power loss occurs, likely it is misfiring, but intermittent. I let the more knowledgeable and skilled mechanic load up the truck and take it with him. He tries these things.
A. Found the set screw missing and the screw backed all the way off on the 8th rocker arm. Replaced it. Poked around the head to find it, hopefully the drain pain. Never had any noise as if something was rattling and everything still looks cherry.
B. Had my spare injectors tested, they function great, so he swaps them. Finds the current injectors soaked and dripping of diesel. As of last night, we thought it fixed it, drove it around never made the noise, never lost power. He waits till morning and tries a cold start. Still sucky.
C. Trouble shoots the glow plug system and finds that the 6v relay is completely toasted not activating. The wires appear to be getting super hot going into it. He will be wiring a manual set up tomorrow.
D. Ran a compression test. 1-2-4 read 350psi, 3 reads 325 psi. That is in the pocket of what I want? Not cool 3 isn’t the same, but doesn’t seem likely to be the problem?
16. Next few days he will have the injectors he took out tested. Will wire manual control for the glow plugs. After double checking all the timing marks and the injection timing for the 100th time, remove the pump and take it back to the guy with the injectors and have the system ran on a table.


Any thoughts here? Anyone running a 4D55 block to flush valve 4d56 head with no problems? I feel like we should lock that down definitively and not speculatively. Maybe I missed something somewhere but all the threads on the subject tend to trail off and end before reaching no “maybes” answer. I’m going insane and honestly running out of things to check or replace it feels like. But I am also way to close to it and emotionally kind of thrown for a loop on this thing. Will drive great then suck, start shitty, then idle like a dream. Gets me up thinking I’ll be driving it to work again, then fails me in the morning when I try. Need more opinions that are further away from it.

I have some pictures and videos if you are wanting to see any of it. Unfortunately the truck is an hour+ away from me right now, but fortunately in more capable hands. For fresh photos, etc, will have to wait till Sunday at least when I could get over there.

[gard]

Did more research after posting. 2256 kPa = ~327 psi. 294 kPa = ~42 psi. I’m in the pocket there, 2 psi short on cylinder 3.
22644

Only difference I can find is the block is taller for 4D56, different crank, and longer stroke. Nothing preventing the head swap from working? Right?

[dancinggecko]

Wow, that's a lot to take in. Starting with the compression test, #3 being 25 psi less than the rest isn't ideal, but is acceptable. The best thing you can do for your glow plugs is scrap the factory system and put in 12V plugs on a push button or something in the cab. You'll never have that temperature issue again. The biggest thing about the flush valve head on a motor that originally had a protruding valve is that it drops compression a tad bit, I have not run that setup, but have several protruding valve 4D55s and flush valve 4D56s and there doesn't seem to be any reason that the swap would cause problems. Do you have a fuel pressure gauge installed? I would be curious to know if your lift pump is able to keep up with your fuel needs or if it is starving the motor. I had that issue running a 30 gph pump so I upgraded to a 60 gph one. The rocker arm probably is a pretty big reason for your rough running. I would definitely check all of the valve lashes to make sure those are all good though.

[gard]

Thanks gecko. I appreciate you reading it all. I know it’s a lot, it’s everything. Work I’ve done and gotten help on are in different threads, but I felt the need to compile it into one place. Both for you guys and Both of those issues are in debate. The current plugs are 6v and I have a set of 12v brand new ones. My buddy and I discussed which ones would be best to wire up for the manual set up.

Out of curiosity how long and how many times do you work the glow plugs in different climate temperatures? Or is it based on the time the truck has spent resting as well?

We have also discussed the lift problem, because of how well documented it is here. I was thinking with a rebuilt pump I’d be getting it. But I’m not. The man who rebuilt it will be running the system on his table soon and we will find out.

My buddy has a kick ass electric pump from a 7.3 power diesel. He was thinking we could get a regulator and do exactly what psi/gph we want.
I’m going to scan all the manuals again in the fuel section and google for how much fuel we exactly need to be getting to the mechanical pump for it to be right.

[dancinggecko]

I'd recommend the 12V plugs, they glow hotter and are less likely to burn up on a 12V electrical system. I usually hold mine for about 5 ish seconds, but it depends on how cold it is. I'll also usually hit them a few times after it has started on a really cold day just to help things warm up. Do you still have the factory fuel filter/water separator mounted on the firewall? And where is your lift pump located?

[gard]

Yes it is the original fuel/water separator. Lift pump is mounted on the frame rail just in front of driver side rear tire.

[gard]

Got a new inquiry. When I am bleeding the fuel system my first point of bleed is the screw on top of the fuel/water separator. During the bleed process it sprays with some decent force. Out of curiosity I cracked it during operation and there was no fuel coming out. Anybody else ever crack that screw during operation?

[Bjamin]

Running a lift pump I'd think it would spit fuel unless the injection pump is pulling fuel faster than the lift pump is pushing (volume difference rather than pressure?)

[Topher]

I'm not of any help to you yet, but I want to thank you for posting your experience and following through. I am doing the exact same work right now. I got a 4D56 head, having turbo, pump, and injectors rebuilt. I will definitely be posting here when I get things back together, either to declare success or to try to solve a problem. Anyway, keep trying and let us know how it goes. If I run into anything which may help you, I'll post it.

[gard]

Yeah, that’s my thought too Bjamin. Already following gecko’s advice on a larger capacity lift pump. My buddy has a lot going on and hasn’t fooled with it this week. There is a thread by Unclespence that sounds similar, a misfire due to the injection pump getting too hot, which has to be from fuel shortage, because it’s cooled by the fuel. He confirmed the issue by driving it until the problem occurred and then poured a bottle of water over it and the problem stopped. Looking forward to running that test and getting the pump back to the rebuild guy. He is already prepared to make it right, though he is perplexed because it passed its tests before leaving his shop. Seeing as the problem is intermittent and is exacerbated by fuel starvation, I don’t know if he would have even noticed the problem in shop.

good luck Topher, let us know how it goes, and I’ll keep this thread going till it’s fixed and running. I’m too far in to stop now, hehe.

[gard]

Alright, so my buddy has had limited time but here’s the story as if today.Wired a manual glow plug set up. Got it 100% better. Idles our the smoke and toughness in 30secs or less of on off on off 5sec intervals on the glow plugs. Not my experience with the truck before, but with the slight change in compression, I could just have a more cold natured engine now.The misfire, now, this is a doozy. At one point in the constant airing out of my injectors trying to trouble shoot the fuel issue, I broke the return rail I had been using. I had two extra, got one, cleaned it up, shot some brake cleaner through all the channels, seemed fine to me, put it on, continued my troubleshooting.So my buddy is going to attempt to air out the lines after driving it till it misfired, and breaks the return rail loosening the injection pipe on injector 1. Truck immediately starts idleing perfectly. Takes it apart and examines it. Lead was actually in the piping where they had soldered it together. Limiting the cooling capacity of injector 1, it was sticking and misfiring at operating temp. Cooling down eventually in idle, driving good again, till it sticks, repeat, etc.So, now I am an EGT gauge away from driving the hell out of it. He says it drives better and harder than it did when he sold it to me now. Can’t wait to get out and rip around in it.Really appreciate everyone taking the time to read this and drop suggestions. Only way I even had an idea to try at times, was you guys here. Thanks.

[geezer101]

A win. Awesome :clap:

[Bjamin]

Congrats gard! love me a good success story :thumbup:

On a side note, is your Ram a Federal or California emissions truck?

[gard]

Pretty sure it’s california, but how do I check for certain? A number in the VIN?

[Bjamin]

There should be a tag, I believe its the same one that the engine ID is on but an easy way to tell is by your oil filter. If your filter is MASSIVE, it's California.

[abomb]

where did you source your 4D56 head? I'm looking into this swap, but having a little trouble finding a reliable source for a head. was it new, or is there certain vehicles to pull one off of? been looking around the forum and most links i find either don't work anymore or are for chinese heads.

[Salteen]

here is a 4D56 head I found: https://www.ebay.com/i/153292213634?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=153292213634&targetid=858219882603&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=2840&poi=&campaignid=6470552634&mkgroupid=90044703518&rlsatarget=pla-858219882603&abcId=1139336&merchantid=6316864&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIoba0oqzF5wIVjJyzCh0j1AOVEAYYAyAB EgLFqvD_BwE

[abomb]

here is a 4D56 head I found: https://www.ebay.com/i/153292213634?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=153292213634&targetid=858219882603&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=2840&poi=&campaignid=6470552634&mkgroupid=90044703518&rlsatarget=pla-858219882603&abcId=1139336&merchantid=6316864&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIoba0oqzF5wIVjJyzCh0j1AOVEAYYAyAB EgLFqvD_BwE


Thanks Salteen. That's actually one of the ones i had been looking at. After some digging, it looks like it was one of the very few Ebay heads not from China. got one heading my way, hopefully it works!

[Salteen]

i saw California USA I was like GOODIE THAT WILL WORK so I sent the link on over.

[Topher]

TLDR: 4d56 heads work on 4d55, but the 1983 used a different size of injector.

I did it, finally. I have a 1983 Power Ram 50 4x4. Last winter the head finally went, so I bought a 4d56 head off amazon for about $350. As far as I know, there is only one place in China casting these, so wherever you get yours, it will probably be the same. While I was at it, I had a local shop rebuild my turbo and fuel pump. They also put together some injectors, because the 1983 had a different size. At the advice of several mechanics, I bought a generic gasket kit and a genuine Mitsubishi head gasket off eBay. I got a set of head bolts and a return line rail from somewhere in England through eBay.

The rebuilt went smoothly enough, although I stalled out for a while this fall an winter. Quarantine gave me time to get back to it, though. The only issue I had putting it together was getting the hard lines to line up with the new injectors. I had to gently bend them into new shapes. Nerve wracking. I still have to figure out some stabilizers for them, since the original clamps don't fit. To set the timing, I bought an adapter off eBay for about $10 but it didn't fit my dial indicator. Turns out hot glue will hold it together just well enough to work.

Now the truck starts okay, but blows some smoke and runs rough until it warms up a bit. Maybe a bad glow plug? Once warm, it runs great and starts again instantly. The engine warms up to just above cool and stays there. I haven't taken it on any long drives as yet- quarantine. The turbo seems about the same- 7psi of boost, which is fine with me. I don't want to stress the engine. I still have to install a pyrometer.

I call it a success. Now I need to do some cosmetic work. Anyone know where to get tail lights or the little turn signal covers which mount on the sides by the front wheels?

[geezer101]

^tail lights on ebay from Thailand. They are not OEM quality - the lenses are thinner and they don't fit the rear cases all that well either but they are new and look 'OK' plus they're enough to give the po-po one less reason to pull you over (and they're cheap - the price reflects the quality though) Not sure about the side markers, I've never looked for them but I imagine you'd have more luck getting decent used ones from somewhere than new ones (but you never know, there might be repros on ebay as well)

[tortron]

The side lamps are available new

[Xtsix]

I had the same issue, however I put a flush valve head on a 92 4d56, turns out, the problem is that the flush valve heads are for the 96 up intercooled 4d56 and the Hyundai d4bf, the pistons were redesigned in 96 to introduce more swirl and have a shallower relief in the top of the pistons, using a flush head on a protruding valve engine, regardless of wether it is a 4d55 or 4d56 drops the compression from 21:1 to around 18.5:1, which is great for performance if you throw enough boost at it, but cold drivability and efficiency will suffer.

[Balcorn80]

Great info here.

Anyone know what happens if you go the other way around and put a protruding head on a recessed valve block? I ask because I just assembled a motor with a short block and head from china. The head is protruding. The block, to be honest, I'm not sure. I asked the seller to sell me a block that went with the head I ordered(I did this all on aliex) and now, when my motor is up to operating temp there is a horrible tapping, like a collapsed lifter in a hydraulic lifter setup. I've adjusted valves and timing so many times it's ridiculous.

Anyone have any pics of what a protruding valve piston top looks like?

[dancinggecko]

Do not do that! The clearances will be too small and the valves would probably hit the piston. The recesses in the piston are fairly deep, and the valves protrude several millimeters from the head. I would not recommend putting a protruding valve head on a flush valve motor

[Balcorn80]

Do not do that! The clearances will be too small and the valves would probably hit the piston. The recesses in the piston are fairly deep, and the valves protrude several millimeters from the head. I would not recommend putting a protruding valve head on a flush valve motor

That's why I'm curious as to what 4d55 piston tops look like compares to later 4d56. I know my head is a protruding valve head. Because I could see that before install. What I do not know for sure is that the block was fro protruding valve head. Because I have not seen piston tops of either to verify.

I suspect that, with 600 miles on it, I am not running mismatched head and block. But would like to see piston pics to satisfy my curiosity...

[Balcorn80]

Pulled my head off. Discovered my problem. I used a gasket set for a 4d55t when input my motor together. The head gasket is .05mm thinner crushed than the 2 notch head gasket recommended by Mitsubishi for the 4d56t(but it IS appropriate for a non-turbo 4d56). The directional arrows in the top of the pistons were imprinted into the carbon on the underside of the head.

Problem solved.


So. For the record, you can get a protruding valve head and block off AliExpress and have them delivered in 7-8 days for $2200. All the parts for your 4d55 will bolt on and work fine. Just make sure to use a 4d56 head gasket.

Also, this same supplier has the protruding valve heads for the 4d55t available too. In case you don't want to buy new fuel injectors.

[dancinggecko]

That doesn't make a ton of sense. 0.05mm is less than 2 thousandths of an inch, you'd get more change in that just due to the expansion of parts with heat. The head bolts weren't over tight were they? Also didn't know there were different head gaskets for the 4d56 and 4d55

[Balcorn80]

Factory service manual lists 5 "grades" of head gaskets going in .05mm thicknesses. And in looking at various vendors I see parts listed for 4d55 and 4d56, but not 4d56t. Pics of these gaskets, like the one I first installed, have no holes or notches. Pics of 4d56t gaskets, like the ones shown in the FSM for 94+ show these marks. So, too, did the 4d56t gasket sent to me by the engine supplier.
When you have pistons that protrude slightly above the deck of the block and a head that for all intents and purposes is flat across the bottom with valves protruding, a few thou IS pretty critical.

[Balcorn80]

I do not believe it was over-torqued.the "kiss" marks were universal on all 4 pistons. I wish I had microcameras to have watched it all as it happened. Because it was a maddening 3 months. But swapping out the head gasket did it.

Got 29mpg across the first 150 miles to boot.

[camoit]

The reason they make different thickness gaskets is to compensate for machine work on the head and block. If you take off .001” then you need to add it back with the gasket

[Balcorn80]

Yep. And according the the factory service manual, the first 2 grades are appropriate for non-turbo and the latter 3 are appropriate for turbo'd motors. Machined heads\block or not.

[dancinggecko]

Huh, I guess we just hadn't machined enough of of my old one to need that. I'll have to keep an eye on that when we rebuild it

[Balcorn80]

The readily available online pdf of the 94+ service manual hives a very good description of measuring for which head gasket you need. I also found an excellent video on youtube by Ajusa(an import parts manufacturer) that shows a completed head gasket job, including measuring and head gasket selection. I do not know if it is as hyper-critical on a 4d55t(I believe cranks and stroke are biggest difference. Pistons are the same) as it is on the 56. And now, my motor is a 56 under the skin. I had to time my fuel injection pump to 4d56 specs too.

[dancinggecko]

Yeah, the 55 an 56 are basically the same except for stroke. They did tweak a few things here and there, the biggest things being the head had roller rockers and better cooling passages (supposedly), but pretty much anything that goes for one will translate to the other. What did you set your injection timing to? Depending on the source I've seen three or four different timing values, you might be able to advance the timing some and gain a little bit of throttle/turbo response and power

[Balcorn80]

I think it was .030 at 9*. Whatever the measurement was, it was at 9* instead of 5* like the 4d55 said.

I also scooted JUST a smidge advanced, for that mentioned extra throttle response.

[dancinggecko]

Yeah, I think that is what I found when I put the 56 in mine. I bumped timing way up, I think closer to 2* or 3*, but then again I am running an 83 pump. I haven't gutted one of the later pumps to see if there is anything different to their innards from the older ones, they may do better at milder timing. Now you've got me curious to see what cam plate is in the later 56 pumps, lol

[Balcorn80]

Mine is a pump from the 85(I think was actually built in 84) DieselKiki (before zexel) pump that I had rebuilt at Diesel Injection Service in portland. The only cold weather provision is a high idle pull cable. Rudimentary as heck.

[Balcorn80]

Actually now I'm curious about my pump.
The head from my 4d55 has the larger injectors than my 4d56 head. And I have a tc05-10a turbo, which I understood were on earlier. When I took my pump to be rebuilt they ran the numbers and said it looked like it was originally an N\A motor's pump with a turbo top half(diaphragm and such) put on. So they rebuilt the pump and set it up according to turbo specs. Anyone know a good place to run the numbers off pumps?

[Balcorn80]

Also: more head info, because I have it and I'm hear for information. Both gleaning and sharing.

There is some sort of aftermarket cylinder head part number system that a lot of chinese manufacturers use. I do not know where it originates. But I know this, in regards to "our" motors: 908611 is for protruding valve large fuel injectors, or 4d55t motors. 908612 is 4d56 protruding valve head with smaller injectors. 908613 is 4f56\d4bf smaller injector recessed valve head. You can search those numbers on eBay or AliEx and find the head you may be looking for. Also, AliEx has generic 4d56 injector sets for pretty cheap if you want to move on up to 4d56. Granted, they likely aren't rebuild able. But when a set is the cost of a single I jector rebuild, well...

[dancinggecko]

Hmm, that's interesting. The large injectors were only used on the early 4D55 motors, never on the 4D56. They went to the smaller style of injectors starting in 84 and used those up until the switch to common rail direct injection on the newer 4D56.
With the injectors they are completely rebuildable, we redid the ones on mine a few years ago. You can get new nozzles from Scheid Diesel, once you get those it's just a matter of getting the injectors shimmed to pop at the correct pressure

[Balcorn80]

Yeah the large injector heads were only for 4d55.
If the 4d55s went to smaller inje tors and wastegates turbos after 84... That must mean the motor I pulled from my 85 must have been an 83.

[Balcorn80]

Yeah the large injector heads were only for 4d55.
If the 4d55s went to smaller inje tors and wastegates turbos after 84... That must mean the motor I pulled from my 85 must have been an 83.

[Balcorn80]

Holy double post, batman!

[weelsey]

Hi thank you all for sharing It's great to have found the diffinative info on the heads. I'd thought to chime in in part because I'm told I need to stop lurking and post to maintain my status, but I'm looking for advice, too.

And it looks as if this thread contains a lot of diesel knowledgeable ones.

I'm in the position of owning (3) delica 4d56t and (2) 4d55t (one ford one dodge) engines (plus one or is it two mazda/perkins 2.2l ford diesels).
1990 delica I recently cooked by idling without coolant until shut down boo hoo after years of investment in the engine with anticipation for to build 4x4 diesel mini-truck. 1992 4d56t x2, one with bad motor run dry of oil, one project van needing turbo oil seals so as to not run-away.

now I'm recovering from trek to get rebuilt short block and spare 4d55 and a whole jumble of Ranger's and their accompanying bits.

Was the '83 4d55 with larger injector bores also the one with larger pump head/plunger? IIRC, it was here I read that the diesel kiki had preceded the zexel on the mitsubishi. My '83 2.2l Ranger NA diesel kiki uses larger injectors which makes me wonder the pump head size.

I have a few pumps, including a 4d56t in pieces which I could investigate the cam plate on if that's still of interest to anyone, as well as I think 3 4d55 pumps with the wax motor cold start advance clap-trap - Man, I'd like some with the simple cable pull! - Seems most of the 4d56T from delica's from Japan have no mechanical cold start timing advance and the pump in pieces is one I began to adapt with VW TD pump cold start lever acting directly by screw or cam on the timing piston so as not to have to machine out the hole on the housing for the cam ring business. So there's that

An overheated well oiled engine might still live again with a new head. I want to get the most out of all this stuff. I guess I've established that all of these mitsubishis are protruding valve being pre-'96.

I can put a 4d55 head on a protruding valve 4d56 block using a 55 head gasket but my compression ratio will have gone up.

Can I put 56 roller rockers and cam on a 55 head?

I can put a 56 turbo manifold on a 55 head

both the 4d55t and 4d56t pre-intercooler were rated at 86hp, the 55 with more volumetric efficiency. So what happens with this reverse sequential head swap?

The spare '55 head, the only dodge element, can make my van go again. I think the rebuilt '55 block goes in the 4x4 Ranger instead of a '56, since the delica motor needs some machining for fastening in. But I'd like v-belts....:))

I would get some quality head gasket perhaps in a thicker variety for the reverse swap?

[weelsey]

Mine is a pump from the 85(I think was actually built in 84) DieselKiki (before zexel) pump that I had rebuilt at Diesel Injection Service in portland. The only cold weather provision is a high idle pull cable. Rudimentary as heck.

If it looked like http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=26809&stc=1 it had a timing advance function but also accomplished a fast idle at the same time. This is a diesel kiki from early 80s and is probably more desirable then the wax motor apparatus, or even the VW piston direct mechanism I'm trying to build http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=26810&stc=1

[weelsey]

The large injectors were only used on the early 4D55 motors, never on the 4D56.
dancinggecko, do you have part numbers for those larger injectors you could share here?

[dancinggecko]

Ok, so there's a lot going on here. For starters, I sadly do not have the part number for the injectors. Your best bet would be to try and find a set online or send them to a diesel service shop to get rebuilt if you have a set. Just search based on the engine year.
The 83 model injection pumps were made by Zexel, and the 84 and newer pumps were made by Diesel Kiki. They are identical except for the AFC on the top of the pump. The 83 ones had a screw on the top that allows for easier adjustment of the AFC, which is what controls how much more fuel is delivered based on boost. The diesel kiki pumps can be adjusted as well, it just takes removing the cap off of the AFC. Otherwise the pumps are the same. Cam plates are the same, head/plunger size is the same, and so on. Depending on the year the castings of the pump cases may be different depending on if there were some pump mounted accessories available, but that's about it.
I have not measured to see if a set of roller rockers and the cam from a 4d56 would fit on a 4d55 head. They might, but I don't know.
I also wouldn't hedge my bets on the injectors being the same between the Perkins diesel and the Mitsubishi. Those are two completely different designs by two different companies. Same with the injection pumps. They may both be Bosch designed VE pumps, but they will be configured differently depending on the motor.

[weelsey]

There certainly is, Dancingecko. Ah, yes. The Mazda pump without boost reference (though with aneroid) will be unique. I wondered if the big injectors in the early Mitsubishi were the same body style as my Mazda s2 because, well, they are bigger too. I've gained some familiarity with nozzle options for these.
THanks for the suggestion I'll see if those numbers can be found online. believe it or not the little crush and shoulder washers are easier for me to find.:))
Another difference in configuration on the older diesel kiki is the cable actuated cold start advance/high idle mechanism:
I've seen the two styles of the pump tops and wondered. but what is it about the '83 pump size that makes it desirable by some? Bigger, plunger/head?
I did a little digging and learned Diesel kiki became Zexel in 1990 or so.
I'll be keen to learn if anyone as put the older heads on the 56 block. I did read somewhere perhaps 4x4wire.com that the 56 cam and rocker assembly fit right in there on the 55 head. And the updated oil pump might need to be scavenged from a 56 for the 55.

[gustycrosswinds]

C. Trouble shoots the glow plug system and finds that the 6v relay is completely toasted not activating. The wires appear to be getting super hot going into it. He will be wiring a manual set up tomorrow.


Do you happen to have a schematic or diagram of the wiring for a manual glow plug setup? thanks

[dancinggecko]

Don't have a schematic, but I can send you a picture of my setup at some point

[weelsey]

There are different ways of doing it. my favorite is to have a two position momentary on switch, one position for the full glow solenoid and one for drop voltage one (if it has the two). there are three wires leading to the switch. one for each of the solenoids and one 12v feed from somewhere that's fused, ideally.

[weelsey]

My buddy has a kick ass electric pump from a 7.3 power diesel. He was thinking we could get a regulator and do exactly what psi/gph we want.
I’m going to scan all the manuals again in the fuel section and google for how much fuel we exactly need to be getting to the mechanical pump for it to be right.

It's not a bad thing for there to be some negative pressure in the fuel supply. If a truck didn't come with lift pump as original equipment, the injection pump is calibrated based on the sucking of the internal vane pump alone. Where the 4d55 in the Ranger was equipped with a lift pump, calibration on the test bench would be done to match with OEM supply pump pressures. The pump's internal pressures aren't going to be drastically changed with the addition of a low-pressure lift pump, but get in the ten psi range and transfer and housing pressures in the injection pump are impacted, resulting in changes to injection timing. Still, this can drastically improve the starting and performance of a badly worn/leaking pump.
So what supply pressures are we shooting for on a well sealed injection pump with good internal vane? the stanadyne DB2 is calibrated at 5psi because that is what the lift pump is intended to supply. The bosch VE on a 12v cummins has a regulated supply pressure of 3-5 psi. On the smaller diesels where there is no lift pump OEM, 1.5-3 psi in-line pumps will ease the burden on the IP vane pump, help purge air, and aid in the supply of alternative fuels while not restricting the flow when it is overcome by the vane pump. I suggest opting to omit the filter provided with some cheap in-line filters.

It's wise to be monitoring supply pressure. you need a gauge that reads vacuum. A boost/vacuum gauge will work. The supply "t" will be installed between the pump and the filter if the objective is to monitor for restriction and over-supply. If for example the fuel gels, you will see the gauge bottom. If for example you've added an unregulated lift pump, you will see the pressure change according to engine demand. When burning alternative oils, the addition of a e-pump can hasten the switch from diesel fuel and be turned off when the secondary fuel is up to temperature, as indicated by the vacuum/pressure gauge.

Good quality regulated e-pumps are expensive and unnecessary in most small 4-cylinder diesels with ve-style pumps. With these older trucks, often seen fuel problems relate to supply restrictions and sucking air instead of injection pump problems, and these translate into unnecessary wear on the IP's internal vane pump. Just think that there's the pickup apparatus in the tank(s), rusty sending unit and fittings, water separator and tank selector and connections (if so equipped), fuel filter and housing, old collapsible soft-lines, fuel-heater and connections all before making it to the pump connections. If a low-pressure inline pump makes a drastic improvement in performance, it's time to do some troubleshooting. If you want to do yourself and your rig a favour, learn how to use the hand vacuum pump like the mighty vac or a cheapo unit. If you're like me, you'll be glad when you discover that big, diesel-swollen bug jammed into the one-way valve of your inline pump.