Truck won't start out of the blue?

[Law Dog]

Stopped at a old farm place to check traps and when I got back in no starter the dash lights up but no attempt to activate the starter? Cleaned the cables at the battery, checked the small wire at the starter and bridged the neutral switch and still zip! Pull started it and got it home just need to get it going to get other trucks in the garage to work on them.

[geezer101]

Has the starter motor been a bit lazy? I had starter motor woes with another car. I ended up pulling the starter motor out and refurbished it (cleaned the armature out and polished the copper contacts, gave it a massive clean and pushed some fresh grease through it). I would've thought the starter solenoid would still make some kind of effort to work but I got nada - it was like having a completely dead battery. The brushes are 90% worn out and one of them was jammed, I'll get a few more years out of it before I need to install a new brush box assembly. A starter motor isn't a difficult job to do. The hardest part is getting the armature back in when the brushes pop out of their housings. Saved me a trip to a JY or $150+ for a 'rebuilt' starter motor.

[tortron]

Assume its manual, but I get this with a dodgy neutral lock out switch on my auto trans.

[Law Dog]

Will pull the starter tomorrow and see what' s up with that!

[Law Dog]

Getting new brushes and solenoid put in now will see if that was the issue!

[geezer101]

I would personally take it apart and look at it's innards. After forking out for a rebuilt starter motor due to lack of experience vs how many brush electric motors I've brought back into service (vacuum cleaners, power drills, a hand blender or 2...) and knowing they all work the same way, what mostly goes wrong with them is the contacts on the armature get clogged up from the debris as the brushes wear down. A side effect of that is the contacts get burn marks in them and the debris creates bridges between the contacts. This seriously weakens the motor and eventually it malfunctions. Disassemble the rear housing with the main positive lead disconnected from the starter solenoid and slip the armature out, then separate the winding housing if it already hasn't come off.

I use a fine point like a seal pick or a stanley knife blade to gently scrape out the gaps between the copper contacts then tidy them up with fine wet and dry paper (wrap it around something made of wood with a flat face and use it like a file - work your way around the armature to try and keep it uniform) or alternatively (and this is the method I employ) place the armature in a drill press, set it for low speed and reface the copper contacts. Don't get crazy with it and attempt to remove really deep grooves or burns - try to give the copper back it's fresh colour. I finish this off by polishing the copper to make it bright again, give everything a big clean - do not mess with the brushes by sanding or grinding the ends of them. Don't use anything that is a paint solvent to clean the motor components - a can of degreaser, non caustic oven cleaner, some fuel etc will be sufficient. Rinse it with water and blow it out with compressed air once you are ready to pack some grease into any of the gear drives or shaft contact locations. When reassembling be careful with inserting the armature back into the brush box/housing (there are either small pin holes that you can put a paper clip into to hold the brushes back or you may need to do this manually - this is the fiddly part. Give the main positive terminal a good clean as well to brighten it up as a final step and tighten the terminal nut.

Get a pair of jumper leads and a trigger wire for starter solenoid and bench test it using your car battery (do it next to the car/truck so you don't meed to lug the battery). It more than likely won't kick the first time as the grease may bind it. If it's really stubborn give the solenoid mount a tap with a heavy screwdriver/end of a wrench to 'encourage' it. Once you get a successful kick out of, test it a few times to work the grease through it and you're ready to go.

[Law Dog]

Got it back new brushes and solenoid said it turned a few times when he was testing it then nothing, like you said the brushes were sticking must of jarred loose on the ride to the machine shop was why it worked on the first few tests. Gotta have it working where I take it so it needed to be fixed right hate to get stuck in the river breaks in the winter months.

[geezer101]

Persist. It will eventually free up and kick every time. Check your leads (positive and negative/ground). Make sure your battery is nice and strong (acid levels are right and it's fully charged) and give the solenoid mount a firm tap or 2 with something that isn't going to dent or crack it before hitting the key start. My starter motor had never been out and the car is at least 17 years old. It was pretty gummed up and there was a ton of build up from the brushes wearing down. Now it starts every shot and like I said earlier, I'll get a few more years out of it before the brushes are completely toast. Did they service the armature? It's not enough to bang some new brushes into it and hope for the best. It's those copper contacts and how they conduct current that will determine how well the starter turns over. If the solenoid was dead, the starter motor would still spin but not engage. Like wise the opposite - no spin but the solenoid will kick.

[Law Dog]

He said the armature looked fine he did say there was a auto and manual type of starter and the auto had more cranking power? The one I had was off of an auto I scraped. Will get it in today and see if it fires up!

[geezer101]

The armature 'looked' fine? This is why I bite the bullet and do my own stuff. Let's say the act of pulling the armature out stripped a little bit of surface oxidisation off the copper contacts and it found life albeit short. The starter needs current through it as this is what generates the necessary force to throw the gear forward and engage the ring gear. And be careful mix and matching starter motors - they have different drive gears on them and they won't mesh properly. It can wreck the ring gear.

[Law Dog]

Worked like a charm worked like it should of now.

[geezer101]

Nice :thumbup: