gas mileage

[hemi2.6]

I have a 1989 power ram 50 2.6l 4x4 the previous owner put on the Weber 32/36 dfve carburator I was reading through the post and came along the post talking about the counterfeit Weber carbs I went out and checked and I have the counterfeit Weber the truck runs fine accept for the gas mileage has dropped when I first got it I was getting 16 to 17 miles a gallon now I am getting 10 to 11 miles a gallon . Being that is winter I will let it run at least 10 to 15 minutes to warm up to get some heat because the heater does not work the best but that is another issue would letting it idle for 10 to 15 minutes affect the gas mileage that much I have seen on some of the post some people are getting 20 pluses miles a gallon are they 2 wheel drive or four wheel drive if my gas mileage does not get better once it warms up I am going to replace the carb with a real weber

[hemi2.6]

I have owned the truck for six months

[ragragtimetime]

the 1983 4x4 has a 2.6 original carb & gutted cat but recently got 16mpg in 4wd -20f driving @ 85+ & constantly holding the pedal to the floor (i am making sure i get all the bugs worked out before handing over the keys to my daughter). I am glad you elaborated on your heat issue as I strongly believe the issues are tied together & not the false weber (unless the choke mechanism needs adjusting or is not receiving voltage / air filter dirty)......a few other things to check: your temp readout indicates to me that thermostat is incorrect "the" service manual recommends 88c (190f) OR MORE with jiggle valve (i run a stant 45869 which is 195f in the 1983 g54b) improper engine temp will cause low fuel economy (i know your thinking its gonna run too hot, read on). another item to check is spark plugs (@ sometime the cross reference charts got messed up & most parts stores will recommend a hotter plug & not show the following) for a g54b "the" service manual recommends NGK bur6ea-11 or ND w20epr-s11 (i had trouble locating either of these for a reasonable price & run an equivalent autolite 63 @ $2.19 each in the 1983 g54b). improper spark plug heat value will cause fuel economy issue (if you are an ngk lover like i am always remember their chart is opposite of most..the lower the #=hot & the higher the #=cold). another item is faulty advance mechanism (this may mean something as simple as vacuum leak) "typically" the line gets old & "usually" only cracks where it attaches. i recently had discovered 1 on the 1983 (after i was sure got all of them) & it was cracked on the underside where i couldn't see, after a quick snip off of the last 1/2" & reapply it was noticeably smoother. so check the line to the vacuum advance. another item is timing should be about 7 btdc (i run the 1983 around 9btdc).

[pennyman1]

I second all that ragragtimetime said - the hotter thermostat makes these run better and not too hot - the earlier trucks used to have 180 degree stats for us and 195 for canada - I swapped Geronimo's stat for a 195 and never had a problem with him running. I also run an equivalent platinum version of the NGK and a MSD blaster coil and Nology wires, with the timing at 10 btdc

[hemi2.6]

I changed the theromost before winter to the 180 degree one the spark plugs are champion copper core pluse part number 415 they have been in for two weeks and the cap rotor and wires where changed at the same parts store has the stant 45869 theromost going to Chang that tomorrow and check the vacuum lines thanks for the information will let you know what happens after the theromost change

[hemi2.6]

I cross reference the champion 415 plugs and they are equivalent autolite 63 changed the theromost and noticed a big difference in the heat checked the vacuum lines and they looked good couldn't check the timeing because I do not have a timeing light as for the gas mileage don't know if it made a difference going to fill it up tomorrow before work and let you known in a week

[noahwins]

I don't know if this has any application at all to these trucks but Champion copper plugs instead of recommended NGK or Bosch were notorious for destroying heads on Kawasaki motorcycles. Just a thought, take that with a huge grain of salt. I don't know one way or the other. But because of their reputation, I won't use Champion plugs in anything that's not specified for them.

Then again, those old Kwak bikes were finicky and fragile, Mitsu trucks are anything but...

[pennyman1]

Japanese cars and trucks run best with japanese plugs, and champions are garbage - have been for 30 years. I ran autolite plats in Geronimo before switching to NGK plats - made a noticable difference in performance for the better.

[Andy 2]

I have the '89 4x4 also, with the sports cab. I put a weber 32/36 on it in Dec. after being so impressed with the Weber conversion on the '88. I use a 192 deg. thermostat, NGK BPR5ES-11 plugs with NGK wires and timing about 9 deg. btdc. I'm getting 17-20 miles to the imperial gallon. If you're getting 17 to the American gallon that's not bad for a 4x4. 2.6 litres is a big 4 cylinder. Warm up time will affect your gas mileage. At 15 min. each time, twice a day say, thats 2 1/2 hours of run time, at higher idle, in 5 days, with no distance travelled. I estimate warm up time to be the same as driving 30 mph. I let my truck warm up for about 5 min. After that it will idle fine with the choke off, and it warms up faster driving it than letting it sit and idle. At -20 deg C my transmission oil is like molasses and takes a while to warm up and thin out. This will affect the fuel economy as well.

[hemi2.6]

How would a spark plug destroy a head ?

[Merrill]

Japanese cars and trucks run best with japanese plugs, and champions are garbage - have been for 30 years. I ran autolite plats in Geronimo before switching to NGK plats - made a noticable difference in performance for the better.

^^This.

Champion is pure shit lol. Autolite was great at one point in time, but now I see a lot of them have a problem keeping their gap. It tends to expand and waste the plug. NGK or Denso would be a great choice. Don't waste time or money on fancy plugs either. There is no need for them.

[noahwins]

How would a spark plug destroy a head ?

On Kawasakis at least, the electrodes would melt off or even snap off, dropping chunks of metal into the cylinder, even with correct fuel, timing, heat range and cross-reference plug number. Sometimes the ceramic would fail and crack, leading to severe misfiring or weird short circuits. The threads would expand and seize, even with liberal doses of anti-seize lubricant. All kinds of problems. Something about Champion plugs that Kawasaki bikes really, really did not like. Maybe it was just a bad era for Champion quality control or something and it certainly didn't happen every time someone used Champion plugs but I saw enough online gore photos of the damage done to scare me off the brand forever.

[LSR Mike]

We used to call the Kawasaki's a Crock-o-Hockey...Hockey being slang for Dung in these parts...

[noahwins]

They were pretty awful bikes come to think of it...

[pennyman1]

My grandma called them kowalski motorcycles ... kinda fitting...

[hemi2.6]

I changed out the champion415 to ngk-bpr6e6-11,put a stant 4586d thermostat in added some sta-bil marine ,and I got 16.5 miles per gallon

[noahwins]

That's pretty good, right?

[ragragtimetime]

sweet!....according to your first post you are back to your original mpg...now slowly change/check 1 item at a time to become the ultimate hypermiler: ie-don't idle excessively, take off slowly, check tire pressure, check any excessive drag in the driveline/brakes, keep a distance & rarely use the brakes, maintain a steady speed even when cornering (within reason),etc...(you already know all this). you should be able to gain close to another 10 mpg...but that won't be as fun as driving it with the pedal to the floor.

[rxinhed]

1. Is your Weber fuel pressure regulated?
2. Water tire size do you have, and is the speedo drive gear correct for the tire size?
3. Does the clutch slip?
4. City or Highway mileage, or combo?
5. Running a quality fuel? As in 'no ethanol'? Ethanol fuels do not burn as 'slowly' and non-ethanol fuels and don't have the octane rating equivalent.

[Andy 2]

That's right. Fuels with ethanol don't deliver the same gas mileage. The difference is not that much though. Ethanol raises the octane level also. All the regular and mid grade gas around my area has up to 10% ethanol. I think the premium may be ethanol free but if we pay for premium gas to get 3% better fuel economy I think we'd be spending more. I'd say you're right in the ballpark at 16 1/2 mpg. Here's what the gov't says the truck gets.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/6085.shtml

I've been reading about a product called Ethanol Defense. It's claimed to improve performance and economy. Check this out.

http://www.bellperformance.com/testimonials/bid/113918/Ethanol-Defense-Review-An-Automotive-Professor-s-Experiment?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_content=fe2faddb-3640-4eab-889f-2757c4742ce8

[BradMph]

Does anyone know what state is the only state that does not put ethanol in their fuel? You have one guess and no cheating, lol.

[Andy 2]

Being a Canadian, I couldn't name all the states, but I'll guess it's Alaska. They don't grow corn in Alaska.

[pennyman1]

its Washington state - for ethanol fuel treatment use Sta-bil Marine ethanol treatment. 1 oz to 10 gallons - good for any gas powered machine. It negates the effects of ethanol and boosts fuel economy. Been running it in all of my vechiles for 2 - 3 years now - I buy it by the gallon to refill the 32 oz bottle I use.

[BradMph]

Alaska! we have a winner. Do you know why Alaska is the only state? (hmm, going to go check why :think:, must be a good reason) Corn you say...sounds correct too, the farmers don't win the vote up there. :)

[pennyman1]

and its too far to haul the ethanol to mix with the gas. They are the 50th state, I think...

[hemi2.6]

1.fuel pressure is not regulated
2.tire size 225/75-15
3.automatic transmission
4.city driveing
5.gas does have ethanol

[Redneckmoparman]

Yeah DEFINATELY not wa lol we have that wonderful up to 10% ethanol blend at EVERY pump =/. I think the problem with Alaska is the temperatures are so low for so long that the ethanol blend causes issues. Even though the great lakes area is almost the same lol. Does Canada have non ethanol fuels in the north? If so, i would guess that is the reason why.

[pennyman1]

can't stand that ethanol crap either - there is a bill in congress to eliminate ethanol in gasoline - fat chance of that happening - the corn lobby is to powerful for that to happen.

[BradMph]

Try Pacific Pride Fuel stations. They are ethanol freee



Yeah DEFINATELY not wa lol we have that wonderful up to 10% ethanol blend at EVERY pump =/. I think the problem with Alaska is the temperatures are so low for so long that the ethanol blend causes issues. Even though the great lakes area is almost the same lol. Does Canada have non ethanol fuels in the north? If so, i would guess that is the reason why.

[Redneckmoparman]

Yeah brad pac pride and two other locals here have ethanol free 87octane avaliable, usually at or more than 92 octane and i run 92 octane in almost all my junk, besides the old carbd junk, and then i just run the cheapest of the cheap lol. Not very useful to find ethanol free when its only in the junk octane. And yes i only run it in vehicles that are calibrated to run on 92(my neons are custom dyno tuned with a high output calibration by the one and only guy that is able to tune a neon)

[BradMph]

I have not had a chance to run a non ethanol fuel since I have rebuilt my trucks engine. I will be trying it soon though. I recently dropped a tank of high octane in since gas prices are so low and it sure seemed like it enjoyed it. I can use the full range of octane with no ill effects like knocking or added heat from them. But, my Toyota MR2 is not so cooperative. It wants only the highest octane and is required by manufacture specs.

I just got a Pac Pride credit card just for the non ethanol, so my boat will stop running so crappy and it is just healthier for our combustion engines.
Putting dead dinosaurs in my fuel tank sure sounds a lot better then shoving a cob of corn in it. :rolleyes:

[Redneckmoparman]

Well ethanol is actually not bad for the engine, just for the rubber in the fuel system. Its a much higher octane(dont let the number at the pump fool you), therefore allowing a lot more timing and ability to create power, but requires a much greater amount of fuel(runs at like 10:1 for stoich instead of the 14.7:1 that gasoline does.) Downsides are it eats rubber so you need to buy special stuff and it sours a lot quicker than standard gasoline. That is why non ethanol gas is good for boats and lawn equipment and the like since they do a whole lot of sitting around. As far as octane goes, the lower the octane the faster and more potent it is, and the higher the octane the lower the burn rate is and is better at combating detationation. This is why high compression motors and boosted motors require much higher octane, they are more potent and would burn so fast it wouldnt make the proper amount of power. There are a lot of different factors into the type of fuel and octane. Our trucks on stock ignition and timing settings are not designed to run higher octane, but with higher compression, boost, or increased timing, you can take advantage of a higher octane and get more power out of the same amount of gasoline, therefore making it more efficient. The cost difference is also MUCH less than what you would think it is for a 15 gallon fillup, a difference of $0.20 ($2.59 for regular and $2.79 for premium) per gallon would net you a cost difference of $3.00 to fill with 92 octane instead of 87 octane and greatly reduces the chance for pre-detenation and engine knock. Granted if an engine is only designed to run on 87 octane you will not see any performance gain(usually a loss due to incomplete burn since it doesnt burn fast enough) This is only the basics and the start of the differences and different advantages

[Andy 2]

I think corn cobs take longer to decay than the dinosaurs did. If you shoved one in the tank you'd be hearing it clunking around till the doors rotted off. It must cost more to produce ethanol than the ethanol is worth, and generate more greenhouse gas than the ethanol is supposed to reduce. We'd probably be better off if they took the ethanol out and put the lead back in..lol

[BradMph]

I vote for lead, makes engines quiet and valves last way longer. :thumbup: When was the last time you seen a 3 eyed fish at the local pond also. http://www.mightyram50.net/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=10767&d=1406516267 naaa lead is good, I only had 2 eyes before lead.

[pennyman1]

hey, homer's looking for that fish - it belongs by the power plant...

[Andy 2]

I don't know how up to date this is but it lists gas stations that sell ethanol free gas in Canada and the U.S. Just click on your state or province abbreviation for a list.

[Andy 2]

http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp?

[hemi2.6]

15.5 mpg on my last tank

[Andy 2]

Are you happy with that?

[hemi2.6]

Yes considereding all my driving is in town and my start time has changed at my second job I had twenty minutes between the two now I have fifteen and I have to use a little more foot on the gas so I can be there on time

[Andy 2]

With our trucks being geared so low I don't think we can do much better. Getting the RPM's down is one way to improve fuel economy. A body lift and bigger wheels might bring the revs down enough to make a difference if you don't lose it to wind resistance. Keeping it under 90 km h or 55 mph helps.